I understand that is your view. I remain unconvinced. More to the point, however, the discussion of who did/said what is a distraction.
we're not talking about future behavior
That's a problem for me. The events of the party are examples, but they are the past. We can't change what was said or done. What we can do is learn from them, and try to make wiser decisions about how to behave in the future. I agree that it's important for people - even people like yourself with whom I disagree - to articulate their views about the past actions, but not because we're in some kind of court of judgment. It's because this situation is going to happen again and we must deal with it better next time. It's also because Song, the Leftons, and Judah all remain members of the social circle. We each need to understand and shape our reactions because we will interact with them in the future.
There just is no excuse for all the push back against her and how she has handled this situation.
I understand that this is your view, but I don't think that being the victim of rape, assault, domestic abuse, and more crimes is a free pass. I warned Song two weeks ago that she was promoting a conflict and now we've seen it come to pass. Does that make it her fault? No. But it's something I and others take into consideration. Earlier in this round of discussion I pointed out to her that she could stipulate a point and thereby advance the discussion toward her goals. She chose not to, for what she sees as valid reasons. I understand her reasoning, and we agree to disagree.
(Writing this makes me want to respond to your earlier point. I'll circle back and do that separately.)
no subject
we're not talking about future behavior
That's a problem for me. The events of the party are examples, but they are the past. We can't change what was said or done. What we can do is learn from them, and try to make wiser decisions about how to behave in the future. I agree that it's important for people - even people like yourself with whom I disagree - to articulate their views about the past actions, but not because we're in some kind of court of judgment. It's because this situation is going to happen again and we must deal with it better next time. It's also because Song, the Leftons, and Judah all remain members of the social circle. We each need to understand and shape our reactions because we will interact with them in the future.
There just is no excuse for all the push back against her and how she has handled this situation.
I understand that this is your view, but I don't think that being the victim of rape, assault, domestic abuse, and more crimes is a free pass. I warned Song two weeks ago that she was promoting a conflict and now we've seen it come to pass. Does that make it her fault? No. But it's something I and others take into consideration. Earlier in this round of discussion I pointed out to her that she could stipulate a point and thereby advance the discussion toward her goals. She chose not to, for what she sees as valid reasons. I understand her reasoning, and we agree to disagree.
(Writing this makes me want to respond to your earlier point. I'll circle back and do that separately.)